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The Protectors® Podcast
Welcome to The Protectors® Podcast, where the valor meets the storyteller. Hosted by Jason Piccolo, a seasoned veteran and retired special agent, this series is a must-listen for anyone intrigued by the courage and tales of those who pledge to protect us. Beyond the front-line stories of bravery and dedication, this podcast goes a step further, weaving in the perspectives of those who bolster and narrate the protector's journey—featuring a remarkable lineup including New York Times Best Sellers and acclaimed Hollywood actors.
The Protectors® Podcast offers a diverse array of voices, from those who wear the uniform to the authors and entertainers who amplify their stories. It's a unique blend that highlights not only the raw realities faced by our protectors but also how their sacrifices inspire the narratives we cherish in literature and film. Each episode is a testament to the interconnected worlds of service and support, bringing listeners an unmatched depth of insight.
Dr. Jason Piccolo is a retired federal agent, former U.S. Army Infantry Captain (Iraq 2006), and author.
Past Guests Include:- Sean Patrick Flanery - Andrews & Wilson- Mark Greaney- Stephen Hunter- Remi Adeleke - Florent Groberg - Clint Emerson - Travis Mills
The Protectors® Podcast
#473 | Travis Mills | BOUNCE BACK | With B.C. Sanders
From the battlefield to the speaking stage, Travis Mills is here to share his inspiring story of resilience and recovery. of resilience with Travis Mills. Co-host BC Sanders.
About: BOUNCE BACK
12 Warrior Principles to Reclaim and Recalibrate Your Life
By Travis Mills
New York Times bestselling author and retired US Army Staff Sergeant Travis Mills, who has nearly a decade of experience coaching others to overcome adversity, shares strategies for healing and moving forward—which don’t just apply to those returning from war, but resonate with anyone who has experienced severe trauma. Featuring his trademark humor and relatable stories, Bounce Back helps anyone confront trauma, understand their emotions, and take back control of their lives.
Thousands have been wounded in the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, five have survived quadruple amputee injuries, and retired United States Army Staff Sergeant Travis Mills is one of them. Since an IED in Afghanistan exploded back in April 2012 and changed the course of his life, Mills became an advocate for veterans and amputees, helping them through his foundation, The Travis Mills Foundation. His foundation helps veterans and their families coping with physical injuries, and offers a program called Warrior PATHH for combat veterans and first responders suffering from post-traumatic stress.
Make sure to check out Jason on IG @drjasonpiccolo
Hey, welcome to Protectors. We got to hit that record button. We are back and BC Sanders is in a co-host seat, probably for the 15th, 20th time, and we are welcomed by Travis Mills. This was on the episode four years ago, episode number 54, november 2, 2019. Welcome back to the show, travis.
Speaker 2:No, they trapped me. I'm excited to be back, just fired up. I'm not sure why I'm not in the co-host seat sometimes If he gets to do it 20 times. But you know what? It's cool, I shot it myself a steam.
Speaker 1:You know what, for now, you're going to be the co-. Whenever I get someone on, I'm going to be like, hey, you know what, that'd be a good guess for Travis. Let's get Travis. I love having co-hosts. It makes my life a hell of a lot easier. A lot of times I'm just mentally blocked and I'm like, uh, what are we talking about today?
Speaker 2:No, I get it. I get it. I uh, I sit there and just blank, stare off and nothing. This all the time. So I get what you're saying. Uh, I have a co-host named Tim for my podcast. He does all the work. I just sell jokes.
Speaker 1:That's what he should be. You know, I need BC to be telling the jokes and we were going to. Today we're going to do we're going to tell everybody what BC's real name is, his home address, and we're going to scroll his phone down below Right, right, right, yeah. Speaking of speaking of bouncing back, I mean that's, we're going to talk about the book today. Bounce back in a 12 warrior principles. Reclaim your, recalbate, your life. By Staff Sergeant Travis Mills. You guys are going to be retired forward by Jocko Willink.
Speaker 1:That's right, that's right you know we, I like to tell people I'm like, look, the books are great, talking about the books and promoting them and having people buy them, look, you know what the books out there right now. But I really like just have a conversation and you know, getting these books out there and getting the word out there is the biggest thing. You know bouncing back. Look, I'm you know when you were talking about, when I was talking about like just kind of blanking out, there's a lot of like a lot of things in world and life that everyday people you just blank out. You're just like where am I at right now?
Speaker 2:Well, I'll tell you what I actually I just got back in midnight from Albuquerque, new Mexico, and then I'm back out to Denver in two days for speaking. So that's, that's what inspired me actually to write the book. When I go and I speak to audiences, I have a great time doing it right. I feel like I'm fairly successful at it and I took my own horn. But when I do that, I try to relate to everybody and I tell them you know, your biggest problem is your biggest problem. Don't downplay what you're going through because of my injuries. My injuries are unique in their mind. But don't, you know, make yourself feel like you're less important, your issues are less important.
Speaker 2:And as I would talk to audiences, and then I get done and I go meet and greet Pete and shake hands and meet people and everything. People tell me their stories. Oh my gosh, stage four cancer, like just last night or two nights ago. Like lady was, like I'm stage four cancer. I need to hear this message. Another guy was like my son's going through a time post-traumatic stress. He's a first responder, he's a firefighter and toss some stuff, and because we have a program at my foundation that helps first responders with post-traumatic stress and things like that.
Speaker 2:So I thought you know how can I relate to people more and have them see that what they go through is is normal, it's not unique in a way where it hasn't been done before. So that's why I took other people's stories in the book and we have a cancer survivor, a widower, a house fire, a divorce you know it's it's mother. It's mother really great sexual abuse and drug addiction and things like that, and people that went to the very bottom and how they in fact bounced back that luckily, my collaborative author, kathy Huck, who was a genius. She found research articles and all these different studies and theories by psychologists and doctors and things about what your brain does and how your body reacts to certain things. And I just thought you know what? That's what I want to know, because when people ask me like oh my gosh, like Travis, how did you do it? I'm like I just had to know, like yeah, how. I'm like well, like I had to and I was like the best answer I had.
Speaker 2:You know, I couldn't like break it down. Yeah, I mean I have three doctorates. They're honorary, so I am a learned man, I've been my alma mater is all, but like I think all one or two days of the whole entire time to get my degree. You know, on graduation day I went there and hung out but but but my thing was I was fortunate to to get better. I didn't understand it mentally like what steps I took or what things. You know I I made make sense to me on why to get better. So this is why I wrote the book, so people can have like actual like oh wow, someone's been through the same thing I'm going through right now and theories and studies behind why they're able to do it that's the biggest thing is like you know, a lot of people don't like what?
Speaker 1:like the veterans affairs, a lot of troops won't come forward, be like Well, you know, somebody else out there has it worse than I do. Somebody else, you know, has lost limbs. Somebody else is like you know, can't see, and they don't want to go, step forward, yeah, and seek help because they feel like they're not worthy of it or they haven't done as much as somebody else does. And you brought up a great point about the first responders. They're like Well, you know what cops have been doing this for such and such years. And Mert and you know the ambulance crews and everybody else, they've seen so many things. I've only seen something, you know why should I step forward? And then the next thing, you know the police suicide rates is it's just as high or not higher than military.
Speaker 2:Oh, I mean, it's insane. And that's why I was so fortunate to have my foundation partner with Warrior Path Program, which is one of the best in the nation for post-mortem X stress for combat veterans and first responders. It's going really well, I'll be honest with you, and we're very grateful to have that partnership going. And then you know, besides, for that I totally am very happy to make, everybody wants to be a tough guy, right? I don't mean I'm the same way, um. But back to what I was talking about, where everybody wants to be a tough guy and I didn't do mental health the right way. I admit that like I ignored the mental health person three times until they finally quit.
Speaker 2:Coming to my room when I was first injured, the social worker they gave me to talk to the second session.
Speaker 2:I told her this is not the movies, like we are not going to automatically have a breakthrough and we're gonna be best friends and I'm gonna tell you my whole life story. I said we're not going to do that and it's cool if you just like, if you want to stop now, because I'm just gonna waste both of our day every time I gotta come here and that's how I handled it, right, but I had strength in community and I think when people are able to have other people in the same situation, it helps them open up and feel more, uh, comfortable with um, you know what they're feeling and what they're going through and um, it's nice to have the warrior path program that we're part of, because there's different people that have been to the program that are the path guides that train it. So it's train the trainer style non-medical, non-clinical, and everybody's got their own you know path they're taking or journey through and um, I don't know. It's just cool to be able to have that as a partnership yeah, I'm gonna jump in, I think.
Speaker 3:I think that one of the problems or one of the facets of the spike in first responder suicides and and police specifically, is oftentimes officers or detectives or police leaders do feel isolated, especially as they go up in rank. Sometimes you're even told that in organizations like now you're getting to a higher level, you can't fraternize, so you know what I mean. Like you can't hang out with the officers and detectives you've got to, you know, only hang out with your rank. I never um subscribe to that, I just didn't, I didn't dig it. But I believe that a lot of people start to feel isolated in that sense and the stuff that they're seeing, even though they may be on a squad, on a team, everyone processes it differently and if you introduce any kind of alcohol or depressive like that or depressant, you start to see it.
Speaker 3:I I think that just systemically that's what we're looking at right now is maybe the isolation portion where you said you've got community, where you've got, you know, people that are coming in to talk to you. I know of a lot of guys and girls out there that that don't have that and that's, that's a huge problem. And then seeing things on social media, in the news and just feeling that whole vibe. It's the same as it was in in 68 to probably 70 or 71 for police right now, if you study history. But and probably same, very similar things for soldiers coming back from vietnam and maybe not feeling that you know the public's there for them, or feeling that isolation, that level of isolation.
Speaker 2:Well, I think there's also a lot of people coming back from the wars of afghanistan and rakhnau thinking like, wow, this is just like vietnam, like there's nothing resolved, just wasted, wasted my time over there, um, and it's hard to find what the purpose, uh, you know was. And I think you know, you get that, you know, you get that, coupled with everybody's telling you you have post-traumatic stress, everybody's telling you you have a problem, right, the word veteran now becomes like a negative, like, oh, you're a veteran, what's wrong? Um, and that's why instead we call like I don't like be called a wounded warrior, you know nothing against the windward project. People think that's maybe why, but it's just, I think the word wounded has negative connotations. It's like, oh, you're wounded, oh, and I'm like, no, I got scars, like I was, I was wounded, um, so I just say recalibrated warrior, but I go by travis and travis and, yeah, you know, my thing is I had to like find my new normal um, and you know, I I just think that there's, there's a, there's a good balance out there, um, that you have to find with when you get out of the military or you know, the police force or things like that.
Speaker 2:Um, you used to have purpose and direction and you know, get told where to go, do what to say, how to act. You knew how to respond to any situation and then you go to like sit on the couch and it's like, well, now what you know. And I admit like I jumped out of airplane, since my injuries, uh, I went k driving like with with sharks in the aquarium. It wasn't like the great whites, like I want next time, um, but the adrenaline rush is never, ever going to be the same as as like getting in a firefight. You know what?
Speaker 2:I mean, um, your blood starts going, your ripping rounds back and forth, you're moving, you're taking on. You know it's just like this, this adrenaline rush you're never going to have again. And I think I think maybe I've never been a police officer or a firefighter you know running into a fire, or you know breaking into a, like going into a house to, like, save somebody, um, but I'm sure it's the same kind of adrenaline rush. And then, when it's all, when all you know what's all done, you're like man now what like life's never gonna be as exciting.
Speaker 3:I mean I get excited because, like I got my kids and stuff yeah, I think I think with when you shift like that like a lot of people have asked me that too, and, jason, I've talked about it when you go in to retirement, and what you're looking at and what some people call the afterlife, it is that idea of like, oh, you're not going to be in a car chase again or you're not going to be in a foot pursuit or use a force or whatever exchanging gun. For I was like, yeah, but, but there's a lot more to policing into life than that. But when that happens and you do catch somebody with a gun or you do catch a homicide suspect or you get a foot pursued, and all of that is absolutely incredible and that's what I tell people like the job is not dead. Seek police, work wherever it is. Just find the agency. That's right for you, that's all it's like you're now a free agent and you're joined in a fellow or whatever. Like Find, find the team. That is is best for you.
Speaker 3:But pursue it and we need it and we still need people to have that mindset of yeah, I enjoy this aspect of human behavior, you know, I mean, and it doesn't mean that we're bad, it doesn't mean that there's something wrong with us that we have no problem with violence and we have no problem Dealing it when we have to, but it's for the greater good. And that occurs when people peek out of windows in a neighborhood or they give you that kind of like, that thumbs up or that, that chest pound or tap, like hey, I'm watching you, I need you in the neighborhood, but also I can't step out on my front porch and say hello, cuz I got bloods or crypts or whoever you know down the street. Yeah, when we, when we feel that it's like yeah, we do get the support of society, much like you know soldiers or veterans returning to the US and feeling like, yeah, we did a good job, we destroyed, you know, al-qaeda, we destroyed this terrorist organization of this foreign force, like we did our job and now you know life is better Anywhere on earth. Well, if you don't see those results, kind of like what people like you said earlier, like you come back and you go.
Speaker 3:Well, what was it for? What's going on? Why are things changing this way? Why are we pulling out? The same way in the police world, you work on a unit for three or four years and you see the neighborhood change and you have actually dismantled an entire gang set and you're like yeah, we spike the football, citizens are happy, and then a year later you're right back to square one because Departments have gone reactive and not and not done that, or officers haven't felt supported.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've come across a lot of police officers that that are no longer police officers, who didn't feel supported and they're just getting into other things like real estate or you know, trying to hand somewhere else. And yeah, I think it's just a sad thing that we've unfortunately went to. I think there's a. Now they're redirecting it. It's coming back around, you know, and that's what happens. And I'm not saying like my time over in Afghanistan was pointless, don't we? That's not what I'm getting at. I just mean that a lot of people probably have a hard time finding like what was it all for? Whereas me, like I went for the guy on my left, my right, right, that's all I went for and I truly enjoyed it. But like the hardest day I've had in my life probably. It wasn't even the blow right. The blow up was easy. I walked into it, then seconds I was blown up and then I'm operating table and knocked out for four days, right, waking up in the hospital. Fire had norms and legs like that sucked. But, um, retiring, like I fought to retire the whole time and I was at Walter, I just wanted to retire. I was like, yeah, I got. I got things I got. Like to live. I got shit to do and I retired and I went to my in-laws house and I sat on the edge of the bed where we were going to stay for a couple months Because my house and maims getting built. I sit there in Texas and just like started crying and sobbing like Uncontrollably and I was just like lost, like who am I right?
Speaker 2:Like in high school I was a captain of the football, baseball and basketball team and, uh, the army. I was a staff sergeant, travis Mills, leader of combat soldiers. I always promoted above everybody else, like above my peers, and I always did a great, like a job above my, my pay grade. You know I was trusted. And then at the hospital, even at the hospital, I was looked at as someone that was a mentor and people would come talk to me and ask for help and advice and, um, you know I'd, you know I'd work out with them and and give them, you know, positive reinforcement.
Speaker 2:And then I got out everything I fought for, everything I fought for. Okay, now I'm retired and now I'm like what do I have left to give and what is my life supposed to be? Because this is not what my plan was. And, um, luckily at the time, like my wife came in, saw me I never showed a kind of emotion, so she's like what's going on? And I told her I was like I don't know who I am and uh, I just started speaking, my documentary was, uh getting ready to come out and then I started working out my buddy, dave Mugora, um, who has a non-probable now a depth training foundation, uh in Texas.
Speaker 2:I helped him kind of come up with the. He came up with the idea for working out with me, um, and realizing that there was a need for it. So, so, yeah, I had like refined my purpose and direction, but that was like that was like the roughest thing, because I'm like who am I, you know? And I think that that was, uh, that's just a challenge sometimes to find out what your identity is. I mean now, now I'm awesome, you know, and I'm humble, in that order very humble.
Speaker 1:Yeah, now the thing is you um Like having that other mission and I've noticed so many people that have kind of come on a show. It's like, and really just kind of like the protective aspect of is yeah, you want to protect other people, but the big thing is giving back. There's a certain crew of people like that. When they sign up for anything, they're doing it for the reason that they want to give back, they want to support society, they want to give back to the greater good. Some people do it for personal reasons. Hey, they need money, they join the service they need, they want to become a cop that's good health benefits.
Speaker 1:But you giving back and that and that's where it gets into your foundation work and it gives back to your speeches. You're always giving back. So it's a different mission for you. And, like you said before and you said, well, the first time you came on a show was recalibrate. You're not the same person you were before, but you recalibrated. Now You're still giving back, but just said, a different way, may not be like the same adrenaline fueled and they, and they heated them on the combat, but you're still giving back to other people who need that, that hand up.
Speaker 2:Oh, I mean, yeah, I appreciate that. So, uh, kelsey and I were at the hospital and we started to do care packages overseas, started the nonprofit, the Travis Mills Foundation. Um, you know pretty unique name I'm not sure where I came up with it, but uh, but we started it when I still at the hospital. Then we had these people in Maine that wanted to do this Travis Mills project where they had. They were going to bring out families like mine, uh, show them how to do things adaptively. They started raising money for it. It got too big for them to handle, like, hey, we're gonna let it fizzle out. And here I am, like I just Went from running this all around the state of Maine, where I'm not even from my wife's from here originally, but like I don't, the people are donating like all this money. So I said we'll take it on. So we took it on and it became our new mission for the Travis Mills Foundation.
Speaker 2:We're bringing out eight families, um, that have been through physical injuries due to service could be stateside or overseas Um spinal cord, you know, injuries, maybe they're in a wheelchair, maybe they're uh amputees like me, um, something that was physically done where it holds them back from from, uh, regular everyday life and we bring them out some other things adaptively and, um, it's gone really well.
Speaker 2:We went from we were going to do it two weeks out of the year, then seven weeks out of the year, now, uh, next year we're gonna run like 41 weeks in person and we have a few off-site programs too and we're one of the top veteran service organizations in the nation, which is awesome. And, uh, I'm not like in charge of a lot of things. Um, I, I said I I am. If I need to override or overrule somebody, I mean I guess I could technically, but behind this computer that you don't see is Heather, who's actually the executive director, and she's a real boss and she's younger than me, smarter than me, she's vicious. I mean, sometimes if she's having a bad day, she'll just fire someone randomly Just make herself feel better. I am.
Speaker 2:She's just like, oh, I'm having a bad day. She's like you, you're fired, and you know. Then it puts me. I'm like sorry, see you? You know, it was my mom. It was the weirdest thing she fired. I'm just kidding, she had a rough phone call before this. I'm trying to make her laugh a little bit. She's like we're good. Yeah, you ever just have people that that think that they, that they have a say in something, and then they, they pester you.
Speaker 2:And then, because you're nicer because you're nicer than then. Travis Mills, you take a phone call.
Speaker 2:And then all the phone call does is make you mad. And then Travis Mills comes in, says, just hang up, what's it matter? Yeah, and then she's just like, shut up, I'm on a meeting and I'm like, seriously, hang out, it doesn't matter. So If I had a middle finger, you know I'm saying boys, but anyway, that's way off on the tangent, my bad. I'm just saying I've been fortunate to find purpose and direction and and to still serve. And you know it's, it's really awesome. Where we'll expand the programs and do the work that we do is people believe in us and the biggest promise I've always made is I'll never take a dime, you know, from the foundation. I don't get paid, I don't get a bonus, no salary, nothing. And, and fortunately I don't need it. You know I'm saying if times were tight, obviously I'd be taking all the monies for myself, because I'm all about numero uno boys.
Speaker 3:Well, it's probably the same. You know your mindset. You were saying like you were excelling in the military, you got promoted ahead of head of grade.
Speaker 2:Um, it was really good, yeah right, I found this 30 pack. It's your favorite flavor. Can't believe that. Great haircut. It's great, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, um, but that idea of and and I learned this, uh, in the army as well, and then Um, at other assignments. I worked at EPS. I had great supervisors, but that mindset of like a really good leader takes care of people.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And teaches and and does everything they can to make that person's life easier or better. So this idea of now finding your, your, you know purpose is like you're, you're getting to do that now. You know what I mean it like. It taps into that part of you that says, okay, I can still help others, I can still kind of build this foundation in this environment that is gonna Bring people in and make them feel better and at least, you know, try to help them out as best I can.
Speaker 3:It was the opposite you know what I mean Like and you know that, like in the military when, when I got out and people were like, oh, I'd never go into army because they yell and scream at you or whatever, I'm like, yeah, I mean, yeah, you get that in basic and yeah, you're your fire team leader, your squad leader or platoon sort of first right. Yeah, you're gonna get smoke, but also you've got these leaders that are teaching you that because they actually care about you. You know, you don't. You don't always get that in any other type of leadership role in the in the civilian world. I mean UPS, I got it, but it was because of the culture of the company. But man, just that idea of taking care of people and building an environment where you can take care of others is pretty incredible.
Speaker 2:I tell you what I love that when people like I was gonna join, but you know, I probably would have fought the drill Sergeant. Yeah, yeah, I had one guy like I probably would have just killed too many people overseas. You know, you're real tough, you're real tough bro.
Speaker 3:Yeah, Well, the funny thing, I met a guy one time and he did the same thing. We were all just kind of sitting around talking and I'm very, very good at nerding it up and I don't tell people a lot of times about like how I grew up, in my background or anything, and so when people figure out that I was in the military, they're often surprised. Well, we were sitting around myself and these other guys talking and the military came up and you know we started talking about our experiences with. The other guy walks up and he's like yeah, I really loved Marine Corps, I love the uniforms, but you know I couldn't join because my parents wouldn't let me.
Speaker 3:That's the worst excuse I'd ever heard. Now I just look at him, he's a grown man. Yeah, I look at him like dude. I understand if you were 17 and nobody would sign for you, but when you're 18, you can do whatever you want to do. No, you don't understand. In my family they made me go to college.
Speaker 3:I'm like what difference does it make? If you didn't want to join, don't join. I mean, man, I knew plenty of people that were like, well, I should have. No, you should not have. If you didn't want full commitment, you don't go into a total institution half-ash.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean. Like that's not what you do, yeah, I don't mind, I have no. Like it was volunteer, Nobody forced me to, I wanted to, so I get it. But when people sit there, they're like well, I was going to, but I was afraid I was going to fight, so like I'm like okay once you go see those drill sergeants.
Speaker 2:That's how many you're going to do, you know, but at the end of the day, like you know, I'm proud of what I got to do. I'm thankful I had the opportunity and I just had like one bad day at work. You know what I mean.
Speaker 3:I didn't see it coming.
Speaker 2:It's kind of walked in early retirement.
Speaker 3:Now, if I can jump in, just to ask, I always like to know, like, what motivated an individual to sign that paper and go do it.
Speaker 2:Well, actually, on my personal Facebook which if we're friends on there you'll see I put a video up from TikTok about the guy talking about the 82nd Airborne Division and basically how awesome a second is. But the band of brothers. I would just watch band of brothers and I was like, yeah, I want to do something like that. And then I was in college and turned out that college wasn't my thing. I was there to play football but I only stood on the sidelines the whole season. I was super good at it. And then no, I was there. I was there, I know because I was there all season, but I was retarded, whatever. But then I just came home and my mom and dad had these rules like, I have my own apartment 18, two and a half hours away from home and I came back to my next semester at college.
Speaker 2:My mom and dad are like you got to be at this time. You can't go out this time. And I'm like who are you talking to? I'm like, that's it. I don't like your rule. I'm going to go to a place where there's no rules. I'm an adult.
Speaker 1:I'm going to the army.
Speaker 2:I showed them. I just I missed the camaraderie and the brotherhood of the football team I was on and I was interested with the military and I narrowed down. It was between the Air Force, the Marines and the army and the Marine guy was pretty intense, right, but I had student debt so there was no bonus, so that was out. The Air Force had a really cool like alignment program where you get your journeyman's card, you get out, you can be alignment. I'm like.
Speaker 2:My mom was like if you're going to go in service, you're going to go do something that you can use me to get out. And I was like you're right, mom, and the linemen course was pretty cool and I was like, man, that's pretty awesome, I can get out, have it all set up. Then, with the army's office, they show me airborne infantry video. I went there, asked about being an electrician, but check this out Airborne infantry kicking doors in and everything. I'm like what? Yes? I said, but but tell me more. And the guy said I can be 20. Here's the thing. I don't tell people this Because my buddy Reggie was going through the same thing I was going through with like college we weren't fitting in in college really, where he was going to college Didn't really want to do that. We decided we're going to military. I was bringing him in Right, so they offered me $27,000 signed.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2:The.
Speaker 3:BF program.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And then that stupid recruiter that he had signed him up a day earlier. He goes hey, do you get three grand if you go before him? And Reggie didn't know you're stealing my money. So then Reggie went and got my three grand sign on like forgetting somebody and I only got 24,000. You know what, though? First time I talked about that in years, the wound's still deep, but and hey, he's. He's actually still doing really well as a crew chief now. He went into his infantry, but he switched over your crew chief. I think he was with the 160th there for a while Okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but anyways. So I don't know. I didn't want to do college, so I knew Armie was going to pay for the college when I wanted to go and I ended up really enjoying the military Like I tell a joke on my second plump that when I was gone my wife bought a house. And I called her one day and she's all fired up. She bought a house and I was like hey, how did you do that? Like you're in college, you have no income. And she's like, well, you remember that power of attorney that you signed? And I was like you know? So she did buy a house with the power of attorney, but I had just reenlisted and I knew we're going to be stable, so we bought a house together.
Speaker 3:She just found paperwork yeah.
Speaker 2:And when I reenlisted I wrote a high heart boobs on my hand. So when the captain said raise your right hand, wham, hit him with the I heart boobs. So yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:It's funny that a lot of people you know that you're sitting around in basic, you know, and you're just looking around like we all look like a bunch of misfits, like we're all from different different towns, different cultures, different countries. I mean I always say like 10% of my, I was an infantry as well. Like 10% of my company was born in another country.
Speaker 2:Oh, I'm working on getting their citizenship.
Speaker 3:You know, just, man, I I loved my time. It paid for my college, it set me up. You know, when I got out on the street as a cop, you know people were like man, you're just too nice to people. I'm like, why would I not be nice? You got, you know, you got to, you got established dominance. I'm like man, I got this situation under control, like if I got to switch gears, yeah, it's gonna go that way, but yeah, I'm not going to be known as the guy that gets out of the car beating his chest and it. But that came from. You know, people were insecure, you know, and hell, half of them had never even been in the street fights.
Speaker 2:It was like even the drill sergeant, sir. I mean in the you know the basic, you can tell the guys to join because they were picked on in high school. You're like oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:But my dad, my dad had told me about, like he called it, the fire in the belly or whatever it was. He's like man, you're going to get in the basic. I was real quiet, real like laid back, and he had been an army in the late sixties and he was like, look, you join those long rifles, that's what they call it. He's like you join the infantry, like get ready. But when you're basic, man, don't, don't fall for this stuff. He's like you can have these dudes coming in there Screaming, yell and acting all tough. He's like they probably won't even graduate that. Watch the guys who don't volunteer for anything. You stay quiet, you fly under the radar. If they tell you to do something, you do it twice as fast as everybody else. He's like, and you'll be fine. I was the best advice I ever had, man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, my dad was in the army as well and he taught me a couple things. He said, hey, look, you want to go to the infantry, that's fine. He was a mechanic, right, my dad was. He's very, very good at that stuff. He goes, let me tell you something Don't mess. Make sure you take care of finance, take care of the mechanics and definitely take care of your S1. And I found out real quick If you want to leave, you slide 50 bucks to that guy. You get your leave approved and that paperwork goes away. You give S1 50 bones and you're done. I mean I had like 200 or 100 some days saved up for leave. I went every time. But you know what I'm saying. It's like, hey, here's 50 bucks, yeah, go away. And you know there was that.
Speaker 2:And then also, like in basic, I couldn't find the radar. I tried, but I was six foot three, 230 pounds, oh, and they always are picking at me. But I mean, then I went to a unit where I got lucky. I went to a unit where a colonel was like, hey, I want three infantry guys, right? So the dumbest thing ever, I had a Ranger contract. And then they were like hey, you get to pick your duty assignment. If you, if you go right now, ranger, you're gonna take six months to blah, blah, blah. And they totally got inside my head. Right, yeah, in 19 years old, just turned 19 in basic, whatever, and I'm like, well, you're gonna go to Korea if you don't make it, I'm like I don't want to go to Korea. And they were basically building up the units to send them overseas. Right, so, 20 me and 21 other guys, 22 of us from basic. We're like we're gonna go to a second, so we go to the a second. I could have picked Italy or whatever. Matter of fact, a lot of my buddies went to that. They were part of that Restrepo area. Okay, yeah, it was during that time. But so I go to Fort Bragg, 21 guys out of the 22. Yeah, they go to 1st Brigade to go to Iraq. Guess what? You're truly Fort Bragg, that's right, that's right.
Speaker 2:And then, and then this colonel's like I want three infantry guys, so me and two guys, other guys from like a different basic. But they all met up same time. They bring us over there and he's like here you go, your, your infantry, this is your truck. Now I'm 19. I have six million dollars worth of equipment signed to my name.
Speaker 2:I'm the truck, I'm in the, the TC truck commander, you know the shotgun seat and I'm saying drive here, go there, shoot there. I got an E4 gunner and an E5 driver that I'm supposed to tell what to do. You know what you do. You fake it till you make it. I was like, yeah, I got it and because I worked in that personal security attachment team like everybody was treated normal so I didn't have like the hazing that infantry guys get when they're units and all that, I just was like brought up like a regular person, so that's just kind of how I ran things when I got up and ranked. I've never like I'm only like probably could count five times maybe in my six years that I've actually ever had to yell at somebody and it's scary, like I don't like when I yell, like you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but yeah, so so I get that. And then, as far as, like you said, everybody looks like misfits, yeah, so I'm not gonna say like I always wear like a polo jeans. You know, doc Martin, whatever, like kind of prep in a way. Right, well, me and so my basic who were like me you know that I hung out with us oh yeah, they're the same, like we all dress kind of the same. We used to go up to UNC and go party at Chapel Hill. There's one guy for my unit, you know that I just kind of cool, like hey, you want to come. So here we are going to this, up to UNC. We're all dressed normal, like the same. Yeah, here comes this other guy, ramirez. He comes out skinny jeans, vans. He's got his lip ring in his hair, like over his eye, kind of they used to hide, and I'm like wears Ramones shirt. I'm like, oh, this is, that's right, people dress different when they're out of their uniform.
Speaker 3:And he said, hey, he said let's go to the Cats cradle Yo, yeah. Yeah, probably punk rock kids out there yeah.
Speaker 2:He had a good time. He had a good time. Yeah, he was the best night ever. But yeah, yeah, I'm not sure I just I always thought that was something I was, that, I was that guy, I was your Ramirez like all in the punk and hardcore and stuff.
Speaker 3:So, but yeah, same thing, like I was hanging out with cowboys. People listen to country, people listen to rap, like whatever it was.
Speaker 1:It's truly yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's like everybody starts getting drunk, man, and then you're like you guys are a little a little out there, man.
Speaker 2:Well before my last deployment I was a staff sergeant and we went out drinking with the guys, right, and I knew I couldn't get out of control because I was out with the guys and the whole fraternization thing. But this one club we went to, this like bouncer, was like checking people's hands. And this one guy, stefan, just the most innocent kid from California Like when I say innocent you know I'm saying like innocent- yeah.
Speaker 2:The bouncer turns his back and I grab stuff as I come over here. He's like what? He's like, I haven't got my hand yet. I'm like dude, you're fine, get over here. And his first shot of whiskey he ever took was with me. First shot of alcohol Pretty sure hey, yeah, the stand was a stand Like, come on, you're fine.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that is true.
Speaker 2:Now I watched many, many young men get corrupted, and I'm like I went home on my first like time for my fiance I'm home on leave for like two weeks and, like my buddies were, we wanted, like they wanted to drink and I was like you guys don't understand. Like I know you went to college, I know that, like I get it, but you don't understand. Like, if you want to drink and you want to keep up, like what's going to happen and like boy, they're all, they're all mad at me now they're, they're always like you don't drink as much as what you, you don't drink, finish your beers and I'm like this is how the army, this is how the army does it.
Speaker 3:Ok, this is way up.
Speaker 2:This is way up the rails. By the way, gentlemen, Look hold on.
Speaker 3:I'm sorry, I will say this, man, when I was in we got business cards from the battalion commander that were printed and it actually says like a phrase on there that says, if you take me to this address, the, the CQ or the desk officer will pay for the taxi.
Speaker 3:And it was to help, you know, curb DWIs and stuff, yep and and it had like our unit crest printed on it and they would just give them out and there was a like a slush fund or like cash that you know staff duty or CQ would, would have on on hand to do that, because at that time the army was trying to clean up that, that era of soldiers getting drunk and getting in bar fights. And I thought that was so cliche until I went out and I'm like you guys really do want to fight. Like every time I turn around, we're we're squaring off with people and I'm like how did that happen? You know, you're, you find yourself in the middle of a fight like owner combat engineers or they're not, they're just regular citizens and yeah whatever somebody looked at somebody wrong or what am.
Speaker 2:I better not better than look at someone wrong way.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's the same and you know it's like mean mugging people. But I'm like man like why do you cats always want to fight? Like did y'all not grow up fighting? You know what I mean. Like didn't you get enough of that before we joined? Like we can wrestle and and do all that. But man like I don't want to be in a bar in some city fighting people left and right, like I don't know, that's bad.
Speaker 2:I was a part of a lurch team, long ranger, constant. Yeah, there's a balance like Charlie troops or infantry right inside of a caveat. So every ball we get drinking and then all of a sudden there's three platoon or three, yeah, three platoons, our cab scouts and one between his infantry and we're. And then all of a sudden, yeah, just mouth it off and it's like on the bus ride over to the gala, like it's. It's like there's a, there's like fights going on the back of the bus, just like we had one kid that was like super good at like karate and taekwondo or something. Mm-hmm and boy, people will mouth off to him. He's just kick them. I.
Speaker 3:Think.
Speaker 1:I've even gotten in my army. 1990s and 2000 stories, but we've never. I've been waiting, I've been waiting. Yeah, shit now. But the book is 12 warrior principles to reclaim and recalibrate your life. Bounce back. I love it, man. Mm-hmm. I really appreciate these publishers to when I actually get the books that I want to read. A Lot of times I get like a ton of books and I'm like, oh man, I don't have time to read. Like a million bucks, this looks like a good one.
Speaker 2:See, I just do audible so someone reads it to you. Yeah, but that's because I can't flip the pages with this, with this weird hand. I can do this and I can do this, but, um, yeah, but yeah, I mean the whole, the whole thing about the book was when people asked me how I do it. I didn't have an answer, except for I had to. And then the reason that I put other people's stories in there is because because I just Want to relate to everybody.
Speaker 2:I think like I was just explaining to somebody that night like I Get invited to the cocktail hour usually before the dinner that I speak at, and this is for a company, cobalt-plast. They're like really big in the, the medical world and they're doing great, I mean wonderful. You know, this is like their sales, like reward awards meeting, and they run this whole nice place out in New Mexico, right, and you know whatever. And I Told the one guy I said if I would came to the cocktail hour, maybe two, three people would have said hi to me, maybe everybody would have saw me and kind of shied away like oh, like you know what happened to him, I'm gonna offend him and say the wrong thing.
Speaker 2:But then after I talk, like once I get off stage and everybody lines up, take picture with me and hang out because I Tell a lot of jokes to make people feel comfortable with me and look past my injuries, and then that's when people really open up. Right, and I don't say this in a negative way, but I become like the world's biggest therapist because everybody wants to try to relate to me. So like, oh, I have an uncle that you know has hand cut off in a combine, so like I kind of get where you're going through, or you know, right, my dog got hit by a car.
Speaker 2:So yeah but uh, but they want to. They want to open up and tell me something to put show their vulnerability, because then they want to ask me, like how I do it, or they want to tell me like this is what I found, this is what I really took away from your presentation today, or this is you know? I really need to hear that and thank you, because I've been going through such and such so I can't talk to everybody. You know there's not enough conferences and talk to everybody but I thought if I wrote a book that cover people's stories that were relatable, that had principles and and showcased how the mind works, do like that, then it would be, it'd be hopefully beneficial and so far it's doing really well. So I'm very proud of how how it's come out.
Speaker 1:I Appreciate you come on, appreciate the book and I appreciate your story and you're always welcome to co-host. I Don't know.
Speaker 2:I don't know. We went up with me and your co-host now went off the rails. We didn't hear you like. I'm sure you got like 20 minutes of that out. You're probably oh my gosh, guys.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't anything. I'll cut out the. I'll cut out one part we already talked about, but that's about it guys.
Speaker 2:I got you, I got you. Well, that's good, cuz the tail band, they, they just cut them. They cut it all off, you know. But no, I appreciate the opportunity and again I apologize for I went way too. My, you know it's, it's fun talking to guys that they can relate, you know. Yeah, so I mean it's funny cuz a Lot of my military buddies. I don't talk to them like daily or weekly, even monthly, but then we'll catch up, you know, and it's just like you never. You know you didn't miss a beat and that's that's. That's really cool.
Speaker 1:You know when you guys were talking about the, the army stories. I was thinking about my call. I'm cycling through my head because I joined when I was 20 and 93. Yeah, the first time then I got, when I got recalled, I was what I was an older 33 when I got recalled. So it's like, man, I keep thinking about the stories, the lures, people and yeah, and it's stupid. I remember like getting out of my, my car and like I had a Kevlar on the trunk and running around people's cars and just stupid drunk shit. Oh my, no, yeah, yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's the thing, like it was the Best of times. You know, and sometimes for the field problems and stupid stuff is the worst of times. Yeah, you know, and people wonder, like, do I do I recommend the army for people or the military in general? I'm like, yeah, no, you're yourself into. Though, Like, know what, you're right, there's over 254 jobs. You can be like a, you know, a graphic designer for the military.
Speaker 2:You can go beyond the news For the AFN. You know, yeah, forces that work. So I just tell them absolutely, if my kids want to go, I'll encourage them anyway I can, because I think it was a great experience and the reason that I tell people to hire veterans if they have a chance in their position position to hire people, hire veterans because In the military you're not allowed to say no, like I can't do that, I use it yet to get the job done. But they have to understand the employee has to understand that Only one person the military has ever stole something from somebody else. Everybody else is trying to get their stuff back. Yeah, so you tell a veteran you need this done any way possible. You better be ready for what's gonna happen.
Speaker 1:Yes, a lot of things get acquired, you know when you, when you go to see AF, you're seeing people with a whole bunch of brand new stuff that they had to go up and replace. Yeah, what's been liberated from them, like Gore-Tex is and everything else. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I'll go ahead, travis, you go ahead. Man, I was gonna say a lot of flippals, a lot of flippals going on in my you know where they had to, like this got broke or tore up or whatever, but I can't remember we had a scrounge. My second point we had like scrounge for ammo and for you know what me and three other guys just happened to come upon like some crates and we we're the most well amowed and suited up very to fight people you've ever met. I mean grenades, smalls, large Smoddies, the law that the AT we had all.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So yeah, I mean that's what happens people just somehow Unsecured and I mean you can't leave things. No job to acquire it, and it's all the military's. When you, when you look on social media.
Speaker 1:They're always like well, someone stole the guide out. I'm like you know what they stole the guide on, but they probably stole like a Humvee. They probably stole like a million other different things.
Speaker 2:They're not dying as the least.
Speaker 1:I'm not and I love the. I love how the the military went to the experimental MREs To say like when someone lost nods or some other sensitive equipment, that's why the battalion got recalled and everything so like, was this about ten years ago? You started on social media like, yeah, such and such lost the experimental MREs and I'm like what is that? Is that like a new MRE? And then it took me a while, my dumbass. I'm like, oh Okay, someone lost some nods, someone lost something out there.
Speaker 2:Just some of the smartest and yet some of the dumbest people I've ever met in a whole entire life, ever ever.
Speaker 1:I mean like. I mean there should really be a podcast about like just people talking about the, just who. The Basic training minimal, don't go past basic training because it gets even worse from there, but the people you experience and basic training oh yeah, my, yeah.
Speaker 3:Great reality show would be like all right, your, your job is to whatever, do this and these are the only items you have, like you know. And then back then dudes are rolling around like it was Vietnam with the MRE spoon Tating to their chinchera. The Mike, the single on their head. I'm like we're. We're in a military where we can't even figure out how to get a headset.
Speaker 2:You're taping a spoon to a piece of fabric, make it work, and it worked.
Speaker 1:We're gonna we're gonna be talking for another seven hours because I'm thinking of, like my Private new with his rock collection. He would just go to the parking lot and just pick up rocks go. Oh my bad buddy. Look at my right my rocks, oh my gosh.
Speaker 3:He's probably a millionaire now that he probably is. He invented minecraft, that video game.
Speaker 2:Did you guys ever like throw the Kevlar upside down and just see who could throw rocks into it? Like just yeah to past time.
Speaker 1:You know, screw social media, and I mean like phones and Xboxes and stuff. It's like, hey, throw your carball over there, look.
Speaker 3:I had some cats. I wish I had video footage of it. That would do Kevlar bowling at night. You take the Kevlar with the chin strap and you set up beer bottles at the end of the hallway and then you use the Kevlar as a bowling ball and just shatter beer bottles and then they all pass out and first starting would come in the next day and the whole company would get smugs or broken glass every friggin hour.
Speaker 1:How about, uh, or how? Here's another reality show the things you find in a barrack shower, like chicken bones and yeah, okay, jim, we're gonna go on for like a second now, oh.
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