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The Protectors® Podcast
Welcome to The Protectors® Podcast, where the valor meets the storyteller. Hosted by Jason Piccolo, a seasoned veteran and retired special agent, this series is a must-listen for anyone intrigued by the courage and tales of those who pledge to protect us. Beyond the front-line stories of bravery and dedication, this podcast goes a step further, weaving in the perspectives of those who bolster and narrate the protector's journey—featuring a remarkable lineup including New York Times Best Sellers and acclaimed Hollywood actors.
The Protectors® Podcast offers a diverse array of voices, from those who wear the uniform to the authors and entertainers who amplify their stories. It's a unique blend that highlights not only the raw realities faced by our protectors but also how their sacrifices inspire the narratives we cherish in literature and film. Each episode is a testament to the interconnected worlds of service and support, bringing listeners an unmatched depth of insight.
Dr. Jason Piccolo is a retired federal agent, former U.S. Army Infantry Captain (Iraq 2006), and author.
Past Guests Include:- Sean Patrick Flanery - Andrews & Wilson- Mark Greaney- Stephen Hunter- Remi Adeleke - Florent Groberg - Clint Emerson - Travis Mills
The Protectors® Podcast
#496 | Mark Greaney | Firearms, Careers, and Thrillers | Co-Host Gene O'Neill
Join hosts Jason and Gene O'Neill as they welcome bestselling author Mark Greaney for a diverse discussion on firearms, unique career paths, and novel writing.
Topics include:
- Introducing elderly parents to modern firearms
- Personal firearm preferences and upgrades
- Career insights into law enforcement and military roles
- Embassy security realities vs. fiction
- Mark's writing process and future projects
- We also talk all things Taurus
This episode offers a blend of personal anecdotes, professional insights, and behind-the-scenes glimpses into thriller writing, appealing to firearms enthusiasts, career seekers, and book lovers alike.
Make sure to check out Jason on IG @drjasonpiccolo
Oh, wow, thank you. Thank you, welcome to the protectors. My name is Gene. Today my friend Jason, who actually owns this podcast, is with us. But the most exciting facet of today's activity is our friend Mark Greeney has stopped by once again, got a great new book that he wants to talk about. Great writer, avid shooter, connoisseur of fine pistols, mark Greening Hi Mark.
Speaker 3:Hey, how are you doing? I'm a connoisseur of bad pistols too, so I kind of have them run the gamut.
Speaker 1:Mark, is it really a bad pistol, as long as it goes boom and the bullet goes downrange? I?
Speaker 3:think that's good. Yeah, that's true. It's not that it's a bad pistol, it's that it has a bad owner, who you know. I have an old Makarov that's always doing something weird every time I shoot it. But you know, most of my guns are pretty solid.
Speaker 1:You know you bring up like different types of guns and my mom's 75 years old. I go down to Florida about two months ago and I bring a little nine shot 22 revolver with me because I'm thinking, hey, that's a good gun for my parents. My dad's 79. My mom's 75. Revolver. I went with the old, typical, old fashioned gun thing saying get him a revolver, 22 revolver. Well, it was a single shot revolver, so you had to pull the hammer back and they're like this is okay. Two days later, later my mom's like dad and I've been watching youtube. I'm in love with guns. Now I want to shoot all the time, but I really want this gun. It's a walder, I'm like a walder what kind of?
Speaker 1:walder. My mom, do you need a walther? And she goes, yes, and I'm like she wants. I'm like I want, she's like I want the jamesK. Okay, and then little did I know she didn't really want the James Bond gun, she wants the real, the .22 version of the PDP. So I bought them. One Ended up going down to Florida again a few weeks ago and they brought me to this place called Shooter's World, which is incredible. I don't know if you guys have ever been to shooter's world. There's three locations one in tampa, orlando and like the ocala villages area, and it's literally it's like toys r us for kids, like when we were kids and going into toys r us and it's a range too and you could actually have like it's almost like going to shacha. They have like this big circle where you can pick up the guns you want to look at, and and she shot her Walther and it was the. It was the funnest experience ever seeing my parents plinking with their little Walther.
Speaker 3:Yeah, does it cycle well Like a 22,. I've never fired a 22 automatic that I know of. I guess, yeah, I guess Beretta has been doing it for a hundred years, so I'm sure they they run pretty good.
Speaker 1:Well, here's what I found out is, you know my mom and her YouTube glory goes. Youtube says you should use high velocity ammo. So I'm like, okay, well, I don't know too much about the only you know, I have a ruger uh 22 which shoots perfectly, but that's what it's. That's what it's there for, it's not just like a small version.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I tried to high velocity and it was jamming. I go to a regular box of standard 22 and the thing cycled incredible. I was like, wow, this is great, it's just a. It's such a cool tool to use for training as well yeah, yeah, absolutely yeah, I think we're up for that. I mean, why don't we shoot 22s now? It seems like our conversations always run into guns every time that's okay.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we love guns. Last conversation was about staccato. We were talking a little bit about um wilson combat today. What's what's what's on a bucket? What's on a bucket now, gene? What's our new guns?
Speaker 2:oh, my goodness, there's uh so much good stuff out there. The the grip modules for the sig? Uh line at a at a wil Wilson Combat are really things are going well for them. We're looking at that. I just picked up, probably three months ago, a Glock 45. So 17 round mags out of a 19 size slide, out of a 19 uh size slide, which is, which is nice. Uh, got to get that milled, hopefully get a red dot on it, because as my eyes age, uh, the sights get further and further and further away. Um, so we're gonna see what happens with that mark what's on your bucket list of firearms now well, um, really the only thing.
Speaker 3:Well, I want to get a can on my um evo scorpion micro, but I I need, or I want to get a new ar. The one I have is I think I got it in about 2004 or 5 and really the furniture and everything is from that era, and I have one of the big older Aimpoint Pros. You know I'm talking about sort of the cheaper Aimpoint which still works amazingly well.
Speaker 3:So it's a gun that looks like it's from a movie about you know early war on terror days or something like that, and it still runs great. And I've taken it to you know dozens of courses over the years. I shoot my AKKs more, and so the AR has never been anything I've really upgraded that much since I've got it. I can't think of anything I've done to upgrade it since about 2012. So I'd love to get our friend Josh Hood, who's also an author. He's got a really nice kind of like home-built AR. That's a lot of fun to shoot. So I need to get into that game a little bit.
Speaker 1:Oh, once you start getting into the game, you're done.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I started off, I had a SIG pistol the M400, because it was a Border Patrol commemorative and it was awesome. And then I started building. So I built about three arrow precisions, actually about five now. Actually, what am I talking about? Like the 9mm to 308 AR-10s, which are incredible, but right out of the box, my favorite AR was a Geissele. Super Duty, really, or is it a Heavy Duty? Super Heavy, yeah, but it's just incredible. I mean, just love it.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:What do you think, gene? What's your favorite AR? Yeah, what do you think, gene? What's your favorite ar? Gene's in mute, gene's like ah, you know, whatever's out there, I'll shoot it. I dig the ak's too, man. I have an american version ak, and the thing cycles. I, you know, I put the magpul furniture on there. Problem is, I have too much time on my hands now. I mean, though, I'm still, I'm working full time now it's all. My whole life is like firearms. So it's like what can I do next?
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I. There's a range of about 20 something minutes from my house where I go, but I don't get to the range as much as I'd like. You know it's. It's. It's kind of a frustrating thing for me because it's I make. Every week I make a plan and I usually make a plan to, to, to meet Josh, and almost every week either he's got something come up or I've got something come up. So it's uh, it's one of those things that, like I, I have I have weapons that don't get shot enough for sure, and I have training that I need to do that. You know perishable skills and all that that are perishing.
Speaker 1:You, you know I try to get out to the range personally to shoot, like once every two weeks, but it's so easy for me because I'm not writing best-selling books, I'm not dealing with, you know, getting books into development for tv series. So trying to find that and trying to get it there, and the same thing with josh. And right before we talk about sentinel, I do want to bring up josh's book, the guardian. Just that's one of the first books in a while I've actually read. I usually do the audio versions and the josh's book was incredible man yeah, josh is a very good writer.
Speaker 3:He always has been um. He has another book coming out in august called burnout. So uh, he's, yeah, he's, he's doing great. I'm really proud of that guy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the Guardian was really good. It was a lot different than what I thought it was going to be too. It was more it was like about smokejumpers and it was about I was like, okay, you're writing a book about smokejumpers, how are you going to integrate like kind of a thriller feel to it? And he did. He did an excellent job there.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I like that you guys write so many different books. That's like I'm really digging this series now the Armored series, thanks. How do you focus your mind from one character from Court Gentry all the way over to Duffy?
Speaker 3:You know it's tough. It's really not so tough in the writing. It's more tough in. You know, like now I'm doing press for Sentinel but I'm writing the 14th Gray man novel and I was doing that 10 minutes ago on the couch right behind me. It's tough to let go and now talk about Sentinel. Then when I get back into the Gray man, when this is over, I probably have a little bit of a transition issue getting back into it.
Speaker 3:I kind of started out that way because I gray man was the first book I wrote and I wrote another gray man and then I did a couple of ghost writing books and then I got into the clancy, uh, working with tom clancy. So I've kind of always had multiple things going on, so maybe I'm a little bit used to it. But um, yeah it's, it's screwy. I mean the the main thing you do is you like my protagonist? Uh, court gentry and josh duffy are really different characters, at least in my mind, and uh, so once I go into one world as opposed to the other, it feels different. But um, it is, it is tough, you tough.
Speaker 3:Sentinel is my 25th published novel. I'm working on my 26th, so you've got a whole lot of things up there in your head. I mean, people would not believe it, but I swear it's true. There's books that I've written that I really would struggle to tell you what they're about. I wouldn't remember many of the characters other than you know jack ryan or court gentry or whatever, but you know a lot of the themes and stuff. I don't even really remember them. I I if I kind of refreshed on it for a minute, then it would all start to come back to me. But there's this many books and that many words.
Speaker 1:Uh, it's, it's kind of hard you know, I had an author on last night. We were talking like um eric bishop I don't know if you ever ran into him. Yeah, he's a good dude, yeah. And we were talking about it and it finally dawned on me that you know, eric's a fairly new writer. He's been writing for a while, he's publishing and he's I call it, my thing is gorilla publishing. Now he's a gorilla author. I like that better than indie because it sounds really like you know, rugged, rugged, like he's a great artist. But we were talking last night and I'm like you know, it's really a grind, it really is work, it's a profession and it's like okay. So I started a podcast years ago five, 10, 20 episodes in. I'm like okay, this is kind of cool. I'm almost you're going to be like episode 490 something.
Speaker 1:So, it's a grind, but I'm thinking about it Like it's. It's like something you have to build. You have to build an audience and with you, you mentioned 26 books, and that doesn't include all the books, that's 26 published books.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah 26 published books. That's millions of words. You've probably written over your career. Yeah, it's over 3 million. Yeah, and it's, it's a, it's a profession. It's a real bonafide profession that you don't. It's like you have to work at it. You can't just be like, okay, I'm going to go write a little bit today and this and that, but yeah, you got to work on it, man.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there's. There's so many times. There's a lot of times where things are flowing and you think it's the coolest job in the world, and then there's other times where you're like there's nothing happening in my head right now, but it doesn't matter, I'm going to sit here for the next four hours and try and squeeze some blood from the stone and see if you can get something going and then eventually you kind of reboot a little bit, but it is a grind of reboot a little bit, but it is. It is a grind. And the publicity stuff is. I get a lot of help being with my publisher, berkeley. I have a publicist and marketing team and my brother is my manager. So my brother helps me with social media and things like that, which gives me more time to write, which is great. But it still feels like you know there's there's more to the writing business that's not sitting there creating your work in progress. There's. You know there's. There's more on the outside that needs to be done.
Speaker 1:And that's the thing is, when you bring up we brought that up last night too is marketing, marketing. I mean these books, don't you have to get the word out there. You got to do the rounds podcast tv. You have a new website coming up.
Speaker 3:I saw that that's a new thing yeah, yeah, I've been working on it for a little while and it'll I think it'll debut tomorrow. Mark grainy bookscom and um, it's, it's nice, has a really good fresh look, has more information than the the ones before and, um, some video stuff on there. It's going to be pretty cool. I'm excited about that.
Speaker 1:I think we got Gene back.
Speaker 2:Yes, sorry about that. No problem, tell me what I missed.
Speaker 1:It must have been great you miss it oh man, we just we just talked for 30, 40 minutes. We didn't miss it. Now we were just talking about, you know that, the writing and putting out 26 books. We talked a little bit more about firearms, not so much. You know, we're waiting for you for that kind of conversation. But the big thing is I really want to get into the sentinel because there's a topic in there that's pretty cool to me. It's DSS, diplomatic Security Service. And here's a little hey, this is me.
Speaker 1:Story is like I was in infantry school in 2001, infantry officer basic course for the army, and I was also a border patrol agent at the same time and I was going through the process with a bunch of different agencies to become a special agent. So while I'm in Georgia, I get a call from diplomatic security saying hey, can you drive out to I think at the time Jacksonville to interview for a DSS job? So I drive out there and I'm like okay, this is a different. It was the most interesting interview I've ever had, because you go to a hotel I think this was an embassy suites and I go in there and there's you meet with two people One's a DSS agent and one is a foreign service officer and I'm like, okay, well, the DSS guy is asking me, like you know, hey, these are the macho questions, these are like what I was expecting. And then the FSO was just like asking me like all these cultural questions. And I'm still like, and here I am, I got my. You know, I'm in my infantry mindset, I got my hairs all shaved up and I'm like I am far from culturally sensitive at this time and geographically sensitive. So I do eventually pass that exam or pass the test, go through the whole process.
Speaker 1:Fast forward to 2002, and I'm in the academy down at FLETC, federal Law Enforcement Training Center in Georgia. They become a custom special agent. So I'm in 1811 course and I get a call from the DSS director there going hey, we want to offer you a job. Come to my office. And I'm like well, I'm here, for I'm already in the class. Gets me down there and he starts trying to sell me on becoming an agent and I'm like well, where are you going to send me? And he's like, oh, we'll send you to DC, then we'll send you somewhere else. And I'm like, oh shit, I already got a job in San Diego, I'm ready to go back to. But ever since then. I always wonder what would happen if I took that right turn into DSS and didn't go and become a special agent.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's funny, I've learned so much about the life and the career. And it's all extra interesting to me because when I got out of college I wanted to be a foreign service officer, so I passed the written foreign service exam and didn't make it died along the way. But I've been in embassies for Sentinel. I went to West Africa, to the US Embassy in Accra, ghana, but I've been to a couple other embassies over the years and it's always fascinating for me to see these people, like maybe young people in their 20s, who are doing that for a living.
Speaker 3:And there's still this pang of jealousy in me. It's like God, I wanted to do that and I was. And there's still this pang of jealousy in me. It's like God, I wanted to do that and I probably, looking back, I should have just stuck with it and try it again, and try it again, and try it again, because I know a lot of people. I've met a lot of people in the State Department who didn't get in on their first time. But yeah, it's, it's. It's always that thing where you wonder if you're, if your life, had taken a different path.
Speaker 1:Mark, it's never too late. Never too late? Well, I think it is. You know that's the weirdest thing about FSOs too is, like, you know, dss. You know a lot of those guys and girls jump out to another agency later on because it's just a tough road. You know doing the security thing, but FSOs, man, they hire a lot of older people.
Speaker 1:Mark, it's too late for you, you're a best-selling author, come on. But in reality, you know, someone in their 40s and 50s actually could look into the fso thing. Yeah, but back then in like, because you and I are roughly the same ages I'm probably a little bit older, I think, but anyway they um, back then it was, it was a different hiring process, it was a different world to become an fso, it was a lot. I think it was a lot harder. I'm not, you know, probably going to get critics for this, but I think it was a lot harder back then.
Speaker 3:Okay, because I hope so. I'm, I'm, I like what you're saying. I don't know if it's true.
Speaker 1:No, believe me, I've, I've because I've I know a lot of people in MI, military intelligence that went out and they wanted to go into become an F. Many of them didn't make it, even if they were. Some of them were foreign area officers who didn't make it.
Speaker 3:Wow.
Speaker 1:Multiple languages didn't make it. Wow, they get to the round table and the team, the team scenarios or whatever. They don't make it past that point. It was very, very tough. One of my high school friends is actually an FSO now, and Normandy and her husband's over in Paris. But it's so, it's the, it's a cycle and it's a different cycle and you have to have a very interesting background to get into it. I think. Yeah, yeah so hopefully that boosts your morale a little bit.
Speaker 1:Gene, you're up. Man, you were. You were taking a little break there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm sorry about that. We had some technical difficulties. Where are we at on talking about the new? Where we're talking about Sentinel? Where are we at on that?
Speaker 1:That's all we talked about so far was just that DSS thing. Man, I know you're geared up. Mark Gene does his research, he knows his deal and he reads the book. So, gene, it's time to hammer Mark Green.
Speaker 2:Oh, you really painted me into a corner with that. So Mark Josh Duffy's back again. Everyone's favorite disabled American vet Does the hero's journey down through Mexico, finds his way out, actually finds himself on better financial footing than when he left. When we meet him to see you write another character to meet somebody else from the Greeniverse. And the twist I did not see coming. I don't want to ruin it for anybody else, let's build readership for you, but I did not see that twist coming. It was really, really good.
Speaker 3:Oh great, you mean in armored.
Speaker 2:in armored, the first one I'm sorry, I meant in armored I screwed. Yeah, no you didn't.
Speaker 3:No, you didn't say something. I just was making sure. Yeah, that, um, that was a a fun. You know I don't put twists in to be mean or to make people think I tricked them. You know you're always, as a writer, you're trying to like elicit emotions from people and and you know as, when we watch a movie or when we read a book and you're like, what the? You know that that kind of stuff, the more you can get that out of somebody, the better you're doing. So I, I do like them. I like to be surprised, uh, when I'm reading or watching something. So it's, it's kind of fun for me when something comes up and I'm like, wait, what if this?
Speaker 2:You know that's the what if? Question is the fun part of this job. It's kind of like skateboarding. You can skateboard for a long time if the terrain's flat, but it's a lot more exciting if there are some dips and that's where the twists come in, and I really super enjoyed that. What is our friend Josh up to this time around?
Speaker 3:Well, so in Sentinel it's three years later and when I wrote Armored, the idea was he's a civilian military contractor completely down on his luck. He's had an amputation of his left leg below the knee. He's working as a mall cop in DC. His family is in really dire financial straits and he gets this opportunity to make some money as a civilian contractor down in Mexico, even though it's a suicide run and it's this crazy thing that he knows he's walking into. He feels so desperate he has to do it.
Speaker 3:Well, as a writer, once this became a series, it's like, well, he can't do that. At the beginning of every book you know he can't be like, well, I'm just going to walk into the you know the gunfire one more time to make some more money. You know that that would get silly quickly, especially because at his core he's a family man. He's got two young kids, he has a wife that he loves and who loves him, and you know his family. The family aspect of him is kind of what I liked and so I wanted in this second book, in Sentinel.
Speaker 3:You see, some time has passed and you see that he's kind of righted the ship a little bit. He and his wife have both taken jobs with the Department of State, have both taken jobs with the Department of State. She is a political officer, fso, he is a diplomatic security agent. So it's three years later. They actually live in a house that they bought. They actually have a couple of not new cars but cars, whereas in the first one they were really scrambling. And I just wanted to show, I just wanted his story to make sense. So that's how the book starts out. He is a mild mannered diplomatic security agent who he and his wife are assigned to go to Ghana, which is the most stable democracy in Africa, which is, of course, a relative term, but it's right there in the coup belt of Africa. There's been eight coups in the last three years in that region or around Ghana. So that's the setup. That's the opening of the story.
Speaker 2:I really I absolutely cannot wait for it. It was armored was was was a fantastic right. Armored was a fantastic write and an even better read. What Josh Duffy represents to me is kind of the everyman character. He's an audience proxy. What happened to him can happen to any of us. I can probably look out the window of the room I'm in now and watch someone walking by who's in Joshosh's circumstance, strapped for the mortgage. Things are happening, yeah, and and you know you're in financial and you make bad decisions when you're in financial straits, and that I. His appeal is that he is just like the rest of us. He's an audience proxy. He's just looking to you, you know, to make sure that the rent gets paid that month and that the lights stay on.
Speaker 3:And that's really appealing.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I decided on diplomatic security because I wanted a job, that, where he still would use his skillset, that he's shown that he has. But it's something that just seems a lot more stable, a lot safer. I mean, obviously it's a thriller novel, so things don't stay safe, but it's something that just seems a lot more stable, a lot safer. I mean, obviously it's a thriller novel, so things don't stay safe, but you know it has. You have to go into the story with this idea that it's like, oh okay, now he's, he has some stability, but he goes to Africa with his wife and his two kids and works out of the embassy there.
Speaker 3:But pretty quickly, once he gets there, the ambassador is going to go on a big press junket around the country to several locations and, unbeknownst to all them, there is a coup being plotted by some outside foreign influencers and they sort of stumble right into the middle of the coup. So Josh finds himself right back where he was in the first book as far as being in danger, except now he has a responsibility to the US government and the ambassador and his wife is there and his kids are there, and he bumps up against one of the foreign provocateurs in this coup who is a former civilian military contractor from South Africa named Conrad Tremaine, and Josh and Tremaine have a history together, so it adds another element to the story. I absolutely can't wait.
Speaker 1:Thank you, oh, same here. You know, when you pull up the DSS aspect of it, too, you could, and that builds a series right there. I mean, dss has their hands in everything. Yeah absolutely Everything. And then you also have the Marine contingencies, and when you're dealing with embassies you have the agency.
Speaker 3:You have everybody and their brothers in there several days at the embassy in Ghana and got to meet the Marines, I learned so much. I had all these preconceived notions. I had an idea there was a company of Marines at every major US embassy. There's 1,200 people at the embassy in Ghana, 650 foreign nationals. So I figured to protect that there would be I don't know a company size element, maybe a couple of like ospreys on the roof or something.
Speaker 3:And there are seven guys and I don't think one of them other than the gunny, none of them were over like 23. And I remember just being like. This is how it is and it was explained to me by the Marines that their responsibility, you think I said would they ever have an outside mission? Let's say they had to go rescue somebody or something like that, and they're like, absolutely not. They don't leave the compound. Their job, their first job, is to destroy classified material. Their second job is to kind of protect people. Their second job is to kind of protect people. Ds's job and the contracted, you know, the foreign security people, that's their job is to protect it. So the Marines have this very limited scope job.
Speaker 3:But there's just a very few of these guys. I think there were seven and they said pretty much one's always on leave. So there were six guys when I was there and they were hardworking. Unfortunately they were too hardworking because by me being there the regional security officer decided to put them through like an after-hours emergency drill.
Speaker 3:That I'm sure none of those guys wanted to do and the whole time I'm sitting there going like God, they hate me right now because they know the only reason they're running this right now at 6.30 at night, when they're all probably just watching TV and having dinner. They had to gear up. They had to go, like, clear the second floor of the chancery because the RSO put a couple of local hires there and said, okay, you guys are the bad guys and you know they had to clear all that. So you know they have these skills and they, they definitely serve a function in there. But if I just written the story without going there, I would have probably said, yeah, there's about 80 Marines and you know they, they are the, the, the first line of defense. But also they would go out in to the uh, into the city, to, to, to do security operations or whatever. And none of that is true.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, think about it this way If you did say there was 80 Marine guards there, you'd probably get like a million negative reviews.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Like, come on Review one from Leatherneck life would be like, ah, you know, this guy doesn't know, but now, mark, you're only going to get six negative reviews. Like yeah, yeah, I remember this mark, I came over here and made us stay after hours.
Speaker 3:So six compared to a thousand yeah, yeah, yeah, I, I annoyed a smaller subset of the population the.
Speaker 2:The research you put in is always evident in the book. It is uh um. Lawrence block used to write this way. I don't know if you're familiar with him, but he almost every one of his novels, was a walking tour of Manhattan. And when you read a Mark Greeney book, if he says it's 80 steps from the front door of the embassy to the, to the, to the Marine Guards desk, it's 80 steps to the, to to the the Marine guards desk, it's 80 steps.
Speaker 3:Yeah, normally, although at the, at the embassy, you you hand them your phone the second you walk through the door so you're taking no pictures, you're taking no audio notes. It was a little bit like drinking from the fire hose because they were just telling me things and of course I went back and asked them some followup questions. I bet there's more wrong. There's more right in this book than most every other book I've done because of the research I did, but there's probably more wrong just by me sort of misremembering things.
Speaker 3:But yeah, it was really important to be on the ground there because I try and write this story like this is what life is like in an embassy. Yes, it's going to turn into this big wild action thing with all sorts of violence and things like that. But at the same time I wanted I did the same thing with the Gray man stories. It's like I try and build the reader's trust with a lot of accurate details in some areas. So when I go completely off the rails and push the envelope in other areas, people will be like oh yeah, I can, I can believe this happening because all this other stuff sort of checks out. And it's the same thing with this book.
Speaker 2:I, I, I remember in in some of the gray man novels when you described uh, you described a Metro station and I had been in that metro station and I mean you were missing like one KFC wrapper, but you were right on with everything else and I had not considered that. That is how you gain the reader's trust. Yeah that's what that is. It makes sense.
Speaker 3:And obviously, like when you do location research, you come up with ideas. When you're there, everybody's like, well, what do you? What do you? Go there hoping to achieve? And it's like, well, I have a few things that I'm hoping to achieve and then I'm hoping some kind of magic hits me too. So, standing there in the subway station in DC or Paris or whatever I do, whatever I do, I just stand there like a weirdo and look around and try to kind of absorb things and picture, you know, what could happen here, what could happen there. So that's a fun aspect of this. But it's frustrating when nothing comes. You know it's frustrating. You go all the way to, you know, moscow or Sweden, and you're like I still can't figure out how to do this, but it usually comes to you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, gm, one thing we were talking about before're like I still can't figure out how to do this, but it usually comes to you, Edgy, and one thing we were talking about before is like, right, when you had that little hiccup was about Mark's put out 26 published books, 3 million words, like when that published and non-published. That's like that's a career, man, it's a profession.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, it's a. It's been a busy. Uh, I'll probably dial it back a little bit for the next 15 years, but hopefully I get to keep doing it.
Speaker 1:It's to me. It's so crazy and I'm sure this is the same way with Jean Whenever we interview authors and stuff is I remember reading the gray man when it came out, and then like years later now we're we've interviewed you like I don't know how many times now. Yeah, it's just, it's a really cool experience and I really like that. You know one thing about our, the author network it's very approachable. You know you guys are really out there and you know I brought up eric bishop before eric's got his new book breach of trust out. Now gotta give him a shout out because he's a genuine dude and you know him and you know, like the gorilla authors, you know the people out there doing it and you take your time for this.
Speaker 3:I really appreciate you, man yeah, I, you know it's I. I find this to not be a lot of egos and arrogance and stuff like that in this industry. I would have imagined there would have been a lot more. I mean, I guess there's always somebody. But, um, my theory is I'm not really in competition with any of these other authors.
Speaker 3:It's it's like if somebody buys Jack Carr's book and loves it, that doesn't mean well, I'm going to wait 360 days till the his next book comes out and then I'll enjoy myself again. It's, you know, they might look for some other people in the genre or name anybody, and there's people maybe that aren't selling as many books as me, and then when one of my books gets made into a movie, hopefully they see that, as I see that that's like sort of good for everybody in the genre when these things are made. When when Matthew Quirk's book, the night agent was made into a film, or when Jack's or into a series, or Jack's or or Michael Connelly or any of these guys, I think it's. I think it's a net good for people who are storytellers in this genre. So I don't really feel like there's a ton of real competition.
Speaker 1:I really want to interview Michael Connelly. That is like you know, I got to line that up someday. Yeah, gene's going to have to, I'm in for that.
Speaker 3:But you brought up like a night agent to bring up these TV series?
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2:Go ahead. Gene, I'm sorry you opened the door on this.
Speaker 3:You talked about your first movie. Is there going to be a second? Supposedly there is. I know a script has been written. I don't know when they're going to do the second one. Hopefully, hopefully it'll happen. Actually, armored, my first book in this Josh Duffy series has been picked up by Lionsgate TV, so hopefully that can get developed. We'll see. I mean, it's always a real long shot, but I'm I'm hoping for that as well. So, yeah, there's, there's things out there and they're definitely saying they are doing a second Greyman. I just don't know anything about the schedule and really imagine I will learn the same time everybody else does.
Speaker 1:I like that. Who made Lioness? Was it Lionsgate that made Lioness? Lioness was actually really good.
Speaker 3:Oh, I didn't see it, it was the Taylor Sheridan.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:I heard it was good. Yeah, I heard it was good it was very good.
Speaker 1:I was really surprised. I was like, ah. But then I watched it I was like, oh man, and they're making a second series, second one of that too. But I'd love to see the Armored series get into something Because, just like you said, they're all over the place.
Speaker 2:I'm just saying that there's. If you were to make armored, there's a lot of parts in there for older heavyset guys.
Speaker 3:That's true, that's true, I mean I know Mustaches and beards.
Speaker 1:Yep, I know at least two of us, gene and Jason.
Speaker 3:All the, all the, the civilian contractors that I've worked with, or whatever I mean. It's a, it's a mishmash and a hodgepodge of society black and white and young and old. So that was fun to kind of write about. I didn't want to make them all. Like you know, seal Team 6 guys. You know, it's a lot more diverse a gang than that.
Speaker 1:Okay, guys, I really appreciate you coming on. Mark and I got more tour to get on there and talk about the book. I do want to say that one thing I was talking about, gene, before we hit the record button, was I picked up a Taurus revolver a 605, and they call it a Taurus, a Taurus optics-ready revolver. So it comes with optics-ready. That's my new little toys five shot 357. But I went out there with just iron sights I needed. I um, I got my license to teach PIs and security guards out here as well, but nor do that I had to qualify in a revolver. So I'm like what's a cheap, reliable revolver? And I picked it up. So you might want to check out the little Taurus's or not. I say Taurus's aren't like the. Uh, they used to be like the 1980s hyundais in 90s where it was like oh crap, but then they got that hundred thousand mile warranty and now they're like solid.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I used to have the uh, their pt92 they call it. That was my first one of those brazilian beretta and I mean it ran good and that was, yes, I had, that was the late 80s. Uh, that was the late 80s when I had that. Um, yeah, so what kind of optic are you going to put on the revolver I?
Speaker 1:don't know yet, because it uses like the little, the micro optic. Yeah, yeah, so I'm really interested to see, because I was really surprised. Uh, I was using 38 plus p's but the groupings were just solid, they're straight on. The trigger pull wasn't as as hard as I thought it was going to be and I haven't qualified for a revolver ever. So it's kind of neat to go, I think, and they're fairly cheap.
Speaker 3:I think you could pick one up for about 340 oh, that's not bad at all no I've had my eye on a performance center j frame oh, yeah, good, 42, I was thinking 1400 bucks yeah, um, I I like look at it and I'm like I don't understand why revolvers costs more than semi autos. I'm sure there's, I'm sure there's a lot of good reasons.
Speaker 1:I don't know anything I don't know what they are though, because, okay, here's my viewpoint on revolvers too. In autos, like you know, these they were an auto we fill the magazine up, we throw 500 rounds for it like it's nothing. Yeah, revolver, I'm gonna go out there maybe shoot 30, 40 a time you know, just to make sure everything's lined up. I'm good to go. I know my trigger and everything I don't. A performance, what more? How much more performance do you need to get? You know what I?
Speaker 3:mean Seriously.
Speaker 1:When you're looking at a .357, you don't really. You know, and I'm also looking at it Was it .327 Magnum, gene? Is that the the round? They have? A revolver, one of those? I'm thinking about getting one of those. I don't correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it is 327 magnum, supposed to be like this, like married up version of it. I'm going to check that out. I think that's what it is and I'm probably going to get some hate comments, but I'm pretty sure that is. But check them out. I had the guy, the tourist president, on a few weeks ago and he sold me on him. He was like look man, we it's not, it's not what you think, it's not like the old school. Yeah, taurus, that's great. I had the pt-92 too. I never had a problem with that damn thing.
Speaker 3:That's never broke yeah, no it, it ran great for me. Everybody had one.
Speaker 1:It was after lethal weapon right yes, everybody yes, no one could afford a beretta.
Speaker 3:That's it.
Speaker 2:Nobody could afford a beretta, so it's like hey, same diff I you know, you ran around a lot in a red flannel shirt, with a mullet and and you didn't carry a holster and you just carried a pt92 yeah, yeah what are these like?
Speaker 1:when he was buying the christmas treat, I was like the guy's like it's 100 or was it 100 or was like 90 or something like that, and he's like what's up to 10? I was doing that the other day. Yeah, oh gosh, it is 327 federal magnum. Okay, I'm gonna buy one I'm gonna show you, tell you guys, how it is next time.
Speaker 3:Tell me about it okay, guys.
Speaker 1:Well, mark, I appreciate you coming on, gene you bet guys, thank you so much, enjoyed it thanks so much, mark.
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